Doubles Only Tennis Podcast

How to Win USTA Nationals: Roster Building, Partnerships, Preparation, Strategy, & Team Chemistry

• Will Boucek • Episode 262

Share episode

Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.

0:00 | 1:20:37

A few months ago, I trained a Dallas 3.0 team as they prepared for USTA Nationals. They won nationals a few weeks later, going 6-0. This podcast is a conversation with that team.

They went from wildcards in the city playoffs, with some doubts on if they should even be there, to 2025 National Champions. They used data-driven scouting, heavy match play, a team-first mindset, and strategy.

If you're a league player or USTA captain, this episode is a must-listen.

  • Setting clear expectations for roster and roles
  • Scouting opponents with dynamic ratings and win data
  • Pairing doubles teams by similar skill and compatible styles
  • How much they played leading up to Nationals
  • Building trust through fixed partnerships and reps
  • Reading opponents' patterns in singles and doubles
  • How one team came back from 1-5 down
  • Making in-match adjustments that changed momentum
  • How to handle a team that hits hard and poaches a lot
  • Targeting weaker opponents without forcing errors
  • Handling pressure in semifinals
  • Being down a Championship point and still winning
  • Roadmap and mindset for moving up to 3.5

Links:

-----

**Join the #1 Doubles Strategy Newsletter for Club Tennis Players** 


**Become a Tennis Tribe Member**
Tennis Tribe Members get access to premium video lessons, a monthly member-only webinar, doubles strategy Ebooks & Courses, exclusive discounts on tennis gear, and more.


**Other Free Doubles Content**

Announcements And Rally Trip Details

SPEAKER_10

You're about to hear my conversation with a team that just won USTA Nationals at the 3-0 level. I did some training with them several weeks before they headed to Nationals. They ended up winning the entire tournament. And we talk about their experience. But before I get to that, a couple of quick announcements. So, number one, a lot of you have been asking about camps, especially a camp at Indian Wells. I'm not doing a camp exactly, but I am doing another rally trip. So earlier this summer, Karen, who is actually on this podcast, you're about to hear, and her good friend Leanne, reached out to me to do a trip to New York. We ended up doing an all-inclusive uh tennis vacation in New York. We had about 10 or 12 people. It was very successful, so we're doing it again in Indian Wells in 2026. It's going to include three nights at the La Quinta, which is a very nice luxury hotel where a lot of the top players actually stay. It's going to include six hours of tennis at La Quinta, a strategy presentation with me, uh, and a lot more. Um, also tickets to the actual uh tournament. So you'll get to watch doubles matches with me at the tournament as well. So it's going to be a really, really fun three days. You'll spend a lot of time with me, get to know Karen and Leanne, and a lot of other club doubles players as well. If you're interested in that, you can email me or check out the show notes. Use coupon code Tennis Tribe for a special discount when you do sign up. But if you have specific questions, you can always email me with your questions. Uh second, thanks for everyone who's signed up for the membership recently. Um, this podcast episode is entirely free for everyone, but I've had some member-only podcast episodes, and it looks like a good bit of you are willing to pay a little bit for that, which is nice for me to be able to keep the podcast ad-free. So thank you all for signing up. And obviously, when you do sign up, you get more than just the member podcast feed. You do get access to strategy courses, video lessons, a monthly webinar, product discounts, and a lot more. Uh speaking of strategy courses, the Surf Strategy course is in progress. I keep having to delay it a little bit, but I'm hoping to launch it later this month. It will be the beginning of December at the latest, so keep an eye on your inbox if you are signed up for the newsletter for that one. So let's dive into this episode. Uh again, Karen reached out to me this summer about the rally trip. Then after the US Open, she reached out to me again and said, Hey, I have a team going to nationals at the 3040 plus level. Will you come do a strategy session for us? So you heard part of that strategy session a few podcasts ago. That was actually with a different 3-0 team that ended up going 3-1. Uh, they tied for second but didn't make the playoffs, unfortunately, due to some tiebreaker rules. But this team that you're about to hear from actually won Nationals, and I gave them the same presentation that you heard on the podcast a few episodes ago. So on this call, there are eight different people. You're gonna hear different kind of audio levels. We did our best to edit that. I just wanted to make you aware of that. But we talk about a lot. So if you're a USTA player or captain and want to go to or give yourself the best chance to win nationals, you're gonna get a lot out of this. They talked about how they built their roster, how they built their team, how they chose who to play at sectionals and nationals. Leanne is one of the captains. She talks about her process for scouting using spreadsheets and an algorithm, uh, and she was able to find a way to get everyone some playing time while still giving them the best chance to win. They also talked about what they did in between their city playoffs in Dallas and sectionals, and then how much tennis they played leading up to nationals as well. And this is a really, really important part of the episode that you'll definitely want to hear. We discussed the importance of playing with the same partner and team chemistry. We talked about how the captains chose different doubles partners, we talked about playing against better players, we talked about how they dealt with adversity together as a team. One of my biggest takeaways from this episode was how their team cohesion and their team togetherness played a role in their ability to win nationals. We also discussed single strategy. Marianna talked about how she was able to start to pick up patterns on her opponents throughout the course of the year and the more that she played. And then we get into my favorite part of the episode where they talk about stories from nationals and how they actually made in-match adjustments that worked. So in one match, they lost the first set and switched to return sides. They talked about why they chose to do that. In another match, they faced uh a couple of players who hit the ball really hard and poached a lot, and they made a significant adjustment after being down 1-5 in the first set to come back and actually win that first set and win in straight sets. There was another story about a team that faced two opponents who had varying skill levels. One of them was a significantly weaker player and how they balanced that. Uh and then the finals. During the finals, they were down 0-2, they lost two matches, they had to win all three lines on the final court. The third match went to a third set tiebreaker. They were down 1-5 in the third set tiebreaker, they were down a championship point, and they ended up winning 12-10. So you'll hear about how they handled that pressure, how they used a bathroom break before the third set to talk to each other and support each other. Uh, and one of my favorite lines was actually from Callie. She said, you get what you give. And she was talking about the opponents. A lot of other teams, I guess, had told them that these particular opponents they were about to play had bad line calls or didn't really act very nicely. And you see this a lot at the club level. But what Cali and the rest of this team found was that they didn't have that issue at all because they were nice first to the other team, and then the other team was nice back to them, and they never had any issues with line calls. So I really like that kind of philosophy because it not only allows you to play better and not have to worry about getting into it with the other team or worry about line calls, but it also just makes tennis more fun. And that's after all what we should be there for. Uh so at the end, we also discussed lessons from our training uh during the 30-minute presentation as well as the on court time together. And then I asked them how they can reach the national level at the 3-5 level going forward. So this is a really long conversation, but I know you're going to get a lot out of this. Without further delay, enjoy this conversation with the 3-0 40 plus national champions. Hey everyone, welcome to the show. Today we have a very unique episode for you. I've never done this before. I'm really excited to do this, though, because a lot of you listening are club level players. A lot of you are USTA players, and a lot of you want to win sectionals and go to nationals and win nationals. And today we have the majority of a team that just won nationals at the 3-0 level. Uh, welcome everybody.

SPEAKER_05

Thanks for having us. Well, thank you.

SPEAKER_10

Thanks for coming on. Um, this is gonna be really fun. So uh Karen and I met in New York. Um, we ran uh a rally trip, which I'll talk more about in the intro and link to it in the show notes if people want to check it out. Um, and then when we got done with the US Open, she reached out to me and said, Hey, I've got a 3-0 team going to Nationals. Can you come over to Dallas and do some training? We spent about two hours on the court, did a little strategy presentation. Y'all already had an awesome team. Hopefully that helped a little bit. Um, then y'all go to nationals. I was following the results through y'all's Instagram and y'all went on to win the whole thing, which was awesome. I want to talk about how you did that, but to start, I want to talk about the thing that people might have the most fun at nationals if they do win, which is the after party. How good was the champagne at the after party?

SPEAKER_05

Such a fun question. Well, you know what? The the champagne, the best part about it is that that morning the champagne was out by sunrise. Um, there were white wine bottles and champagne bottles that were up from about 7 a.m. till we won around 2 30 p.m. and they had sat in the sound all day. And so the champagne was hot. So instead of instead of cheersing in that moment, we did much like a World Series team might do and decided to spray the champagne and translated our after party to spicy margaritas um on the beach later on that night, which is actually awesome.

SPEAKER_10

And y'all were in San Diego, is that right?

SPEAKER_05

That's right. Yep.

Regular Season Setbacks And Wildcards

SPEAKER_10

Okay, San Diego. Awesome. Um, all right. So let's start from the beginning. So at the beginning of the season, before the season even starts, you have to build a roster, decide to put a team together. So this is going to be a question probably for the captains. Um, how did the team and the roster kind of come together and how did it all kind of get started?

SPEAKER_04

So our team came together in 2024, which is crazy to think that it hasn't been longer than that. And I had started off on a TC, this is Abby. I had started off on a TCD team with Karen, and I was a new tennis player, so I was a sub and then just kind of decided I wanted to play more. So started researching USTA. I knew nothing about it, but a friend pointed me in that direction, and I started a team. And then my co-captain Leanne, she and I met at a drill, and I was like, oh, she seems like my people. I think I got her to captain this team with me. So we quickly became friends, tennis partners, and captains together. And we recruited a lot of people from Karen's TCD team because she was the most experienced tennis player I knew. And I really feel like the Lord just brought together the right group of women. Leanne and I had decided we wanted some experienced players because neither she nor I had played at the at this point. So we recruited Karen, several of her teammates, and then we had some other mutual friends that told us they were interested in playing and wanted to play more than just TCD. So we slowly added people. The team started off a lot bigger, but kind of through the couple years that we were together, some players decided they didn't want to be competitive. They wanted to just have fun. So a few left to be on a 2.5 team. And then we kind of ended up with this core group that went to nationals because we all were excited to have fun and try to win.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah. Yeah, that's interesting. That's something that I tell, like, I have captains reach out to me a lot and they have trouble dealing with, I guess, expectations. Um, so like, you know, a lot of players get upset if they're not chosen to play at sectionals or nationals or whatever. And like, I have no idea if y'all have had to deal with this. But one thing I'll always tell the captains is, you know, make it very clear at the beginning of the season, right? Like, we're here to win and we will do what play whatever lineup we think is best to win. Or you tell the team, hey, we're gonna give everybody equal playing time and we're gonna be a really fun team, or somewhere in between. But as long as it's like clear up front, you know, then you can, I feel like uh, I don't know, point back to that, I guess, uh at the end of the season if if things do come up.

SPEAKER_04

And we really had to learn along the way with that, because like I said, we were pretty inexperienced as players and leading a team. And we started off wanting experience and we're kind of mixed, you know, trying to balance having fun, relationships, and winning. And then when it came down to us making it to cities, that's where we had to step back and say, okay, we actually really want to win. And so we did have to change around the lineup a little bit and have people sit out that weren't as experienced. Thankfully, as a captain, I was one of the least experienced. So I could bench myself for cities. I only played once. And hopefully that meant more to people that I could lead by example. Like, hey, I know I'm not the strongest player on the team. So I can you give mommy just a second? Um, but yes, it was hard because especially as believers, we want to prioritize relationships over winning. But at some point we had to do what you know our kids do for sports. If they want, if they want to win, we have to put in the strongest players.

SPEAKER_10

Sure. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Um, so so I want to talk about the regular season. So you you had this team together in 2024, it sounds like, and then there's some roster changes. This year you get your team together again, and you have to win the regular season in Dallas. Um, Texas is typically one of the toughest sections. Um, I've I've heard from some teams who have gone to nationals that the Texas section has has been more difficult at times than the teams they play at nationals, even. Um, but talk about the local Dallas region. It's one of the best, probably cities in the country in terms of tennis and one of the most competitive. Um, so talk about how y'all got through the regular season. What were some of the kind of the keys to that?

Scouting With Spreadsheets And Ratings

SPEAKER_01

You know what's interesting. Hi, Emily Ann. Um, what's interesting about that, um, when Abby and I were co-captaining, we kind of made this announcement to each other on the phone in the season, like, we're gonna take a chill pill and like not really stress about winning this season. And then we got near, you know, halfway through the season, we're like, oh, we're doing pretty good. Um, but we actually didn't win our flight in Dallas, um, which just kind of makes it a little bit more of a Cinderella story. Um, we came in second to Stonebridge, which is a local country club, but got put into cities um as a wild card because we had a high game winning percentage. And so they take the highest game winning percentage second place team and they throw them in so they have enough teams for cities. And so um we were kind of shocked to make it to cities and a little bit scared, wouldn't you say, Abby? Yes, and then um, same thing happened in cities. We lost the great flight um and was the wild card for semifinals um because we had the highest game winning percentage. And so we came in as this scrappy team from the regular season and cities with a lot of I would say self-doubt going into sectionals because we were like, I mean, we got through by the skin of our teeth and we really weren't sure if we belonged at sectionals yet. Um, but that happened, uh Cities was in April, and so we had some time to like think about strategy, how we were going to do that. And then cities ended up limiting our roster even further because Dallas had a rule that you had to play so many in the regular season. And if you didn't make that and you also didn't play in cities, then you couldn't go on to sectionals. So it streamlined our roster even more in a way that we weren't expecting. And so we had to kind of regroup after cities and think about how we were gonna approach sectionals. So, I mean, we we were scrappy to get through to sectionals. So I don't think we went into sectionals with a lot of confidence. What do you guys think?

SPEAKER_05

Rebecca, I want you to answer that when I think about the night before we started sectionals, and we were all in that room, kind of powwowing, and we're like, you're like, I just want to like just talk about that that night for you.

SPEAKER_09

Now I'm trying to remember that night.

SPEAKER_05

We were in you and Carrie's room, and we were going around putting tattoos on, you know, thinking through, praying for each other. And our you were like, my only goal is I just want to. Do you remember?

SPEAKER_09

No. I mean, I actually remember feeling very confident um just because I think we all it was such a fun surprise that we were even there. And I think we're all really competitive, and we kind of will do whatever it takes to win. I mean, in a not it like you know, fairly and the right way. I think scrappy is a good word. I like the word scrappy because I think that definitely describes us.

SPEAKER_04

Rebecca, I know what Karen's talking about too. And your your direct quote was no one wants this more than we do. We're gonna take it.

SPEAKER_05

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes. It was so cute because again, we were a little bit scared and having no idea what was to come. We knew that cities was hard. And so we were like, it's gonna be so hard tomorrow. And we start at 8 a.m. And Rebecca was like, nobody wants it more than us. Um, and then she was like, I just want to make it to Sunday. I just want to make it to Sunday. And so I just I reflect back on that, just being though we had worked and like Leanne said, kind of really the pipeline really trimmed down for us coming into sectionals. There was like this mixture of like, no one wants it more. We're really working for this. And what are we about to see? We were all so scared for that 8 a.m. match. I think all of us except for Leanne, because Leanne needs to maybe share like a little bit of the superpower that she has as captaining our team.

SPEAKER_01

Well, I mean, I love a good algorithm and I love like to really nerd out. And so um we just I Abby and I went through um for sectionals, like, okay, what is at our fingertips that we can research about these teams? And we were naive to it a little bit, but we're like, okay, there's tennis record, we can look at dynamic ratings, and then we can look at wins and losses. Um, but that only tells you so much, and we learned that at sectionals, that like I would say Dallas, your dynamic rating is gonna be falsely low compared to someone in Abilene, Texas, only because you're up against so many different scenarios, the city's so big. Whereas Abilene, you might play a similar opponent a few times over in the season, they don't have as many teams they're up against. And so if you win against Susie five times, it might kick up your dynamic rating a little bit more. And so what so we were kind of like looking at numbers on paper and thinking, oh my gosh, this is gonna be really difficult. But through the process, even though I would say Dallas's dynamic ratings are uh falsely low, we could still win in head-to-heads with our dynamic ratings, our winning percentages, our single sign versus their single sign. Like and so we just sort of mapped out a way to play everyone on the team before semifinals. And at sectionals, we ended up sweeping going into semifinals. So we didn't lose going in, did we? I don't think we won lost anything. We didn't lose anything.

Practice Volume And Partnership Reps

SPEAKER_04

Yes, and just to add to what Leanne said, so she basically brought up every player that was coming, found their dynamic rating. She had it, she had everyone listed out from highest to lowest, and then did the same thing for our team, which just really set us up for success. I I feel confident now that the weekend's over that we would have won, but I don't know that we would have swept every single time without that research. Because, like she said, it was able, we were able to then play some of us lower-ranked players in matches against lower-ranked players on the other teams so that we can all kind of walk away feeling like a winner.

SPEAKER_10

That's interesting.

SPEAKER_04

Brilliant.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah. Yeah. So for captains listening, I mean, this is a great way to, you know, keep everybody happy, get everybody playing time, and also, you know, do your best to win uh sectionals or nationals or whatever it is. Um, so uh I want to talk, I want to step back and get a timeline real quick. So when was cities and then when was sectionals and where where were they? Uh cities was in Dallas, obviously. Was sectionals also in Dallas?

SPEAKER_01

No, sectionals was in Houston. So cities was in so the season ends, what the winter season ends in February, right?

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

And then we had cities in April. Um and then we between April and June, June was when sectionals were. We could really ramp up our research, number one, and number two, just um honing in on the best partnerships in the team, a lot more match play. We did that.

SPEAKER_10

Um what did that time look like between cities and sectionals? Like, I I feel like so so I made nationals once like six years ago, and going into sectionals, we'd all been playing a ton. And then actually at nationals, one of our top singles players spent a week vacation at Disney World right before nationals and didn't play any tennis, and he ended up playing really bad. And like, um I I think that obviously you have to have a good team, but you also have to be prepared, right? So, what did those months of I guess May and June going into sectionals look like?

SPEAKER_05

Well, so all of us really like to play a lot of tennis, and so kind of how Abby said this all started years ago through one of the Dallas leagues is called TCD. It's a doubles league. So as soon as the winter season of USTA stopped, all of us are also on this TCD um in the TCD program, but we're all on different teams, um, which is also interesting. And then we continued, of course, playing together. And so I think what we really spent a lot of time on is actively being on the court. I love drills. I think lessons are great, but I think there is no better lesson than playing matches. And we did a really good job, but we did a lot of um, not just drills and um whatnot. We did a whole lot of matches on within like our TCD teams, but then together setting up a lot of scrimmage opportunities. Um, that's between the regular season and sectionals, um, which was in Houston, um, to answer your question about where we were. So Dallas for cities and then Houston. And some other people might want to, you know, step into that. What else we did during that time, Angie?

SPEAKER_07

I think that's especially true for like Rebecca and I, because now Rebecca is almost the only person I ever play with, but we had never played with each other until February. Our first match together was in February. And since then, we've probably played in like a hundred matches together. Um we played, I mean, not all of them official, but we played, we ended up playing together in almost every um match at cities and sectionals and and um nationals. And I just feel like our partnership is strong because we've played together so much. I just we can anticipate each other well and we have a relationship on the court that is, I think, why we're successful. So just lots of magic life.

SPEAKER_04

And I think the other thing to add on to that, something that Leanne and I felt really passionate about from the beginning is to match partners with the same skill level together. So, you know, with she and I being some of the newer, less experienced players, we would keep ourselves together on line three. We I don't think we ever threw lines because we felt kind of passionate about keeping our lines straight. Not saying we wouldn't if that strategy made more sense in the future, but we also tried to avoid mixing like our strongest player with our least experienced player. And I we had heard from other coaches and tennis um tennis coaches that that keeps a team happy. So we we kind of tried to do that. And we had a lot of fun coming up with partnerships. We would just think through personality types and then also play types and would match people up together and just really enjoyed that.

SPEAKER_10

That's really good. There's a lot of lessons there. So one is uh on court time with your partner is so important. So that chemistry can only be built by playing matches together. You figure out, oh, when she gets that short ball, she likes to hit it here, so I can shift over here. And next time that happens, you know where that ball is going, right? Or I know if I get lobbed, she's got my back and she's probably gonna counter lob this way, or whatever it is. Just that those reps help so much. And then the other thing is as a captain, kind of keeping your um keeping your team happy through the different skill levels. Um, so I could totally see a scenario where you know somebody loses a doubles match because they're playing with somebody who's maybe less skilled and then they're blaming their partner. I mean, that that happens way too often at the USTA level um when in reality we should be supporting our doubles partner, but um it's not always so easy. So I think that's a good way to kind of avoid that scenario. So that's really some really good takeaways there. I want to move on to kind of nationals preparation as well. Um, and this question kind of ties into I guess preparation before sectionals, but I'm interested to hear from really each of you. You talked about playing a lot of matches to prepare for sectionals. I imagine the same for nationals and then clinics as well, and maybe some of you were doing lessons, but on average, uh how much court time per week, let's say in the month leading up to nationals or sectionals did you have? Um, you know, three hours, six hours, eight hours. How how much actual court time?

SPEAKER_04

More.

SPEAKER_10

More?

SPEAKER_04

At least 10 hours. Yeah.

SPEAKER_10

Wow. Okay. So that would be like five doubles matches in a week. So you're playing four or five times a week?

SPEAKER_06

Yes.

SPEAKER_05

So all of us were on multiple leagues going into this.

Chemistry, Mindset, And Playing Up

SPEAKER_06

I mean, honestly, this is a group of women that actually really like each other a lot. And so getting on the court together is not a chore. So I think in the summer, you have the summer for you that all of our kids are at least, we at least have one oldest that can be like, we're gone for two hours, don't burn the house down. You know, so there was a lot of ease in getting away during the summer and then leading up, you know, most of us were on in USTA, both a 3.0 team and a 3.5 team. And then we were also playing TCE. But then, God bless our husbands. I mean, it's just kind of this unwritten rule that, like, anytime someone texted out, do you want to play? It was yes. And I would also say a lot of us did a really great job at challenging ourselves and who we play. So my sisters-in-laws have been playing a lot longer than me. I played with them a lot, leading up to nationals because they're better than me. And then after every match, I'd kind of go, What did you think? What went wrong? What went right? And I used to kind of think, oh, I just try to hit the ball hard. And I don't know if I have strategy. But I think what developed for me, and I would say probably for the team too, from cities to nationals, is one, that's a lot of time to grow as a human, but two, it's a lot of time to grow as a player. And I would say from that time, all of a sudden, I think back to cities, and I was like, just hit it in the big blue box, you know. And then it started to turn into, oh, I can watch their weakness and use my strength against their weakness. And I can do it with this player in this way, and this player and this way. And then if they're excelling, we can make adjustments. And that really for me, at least personally, is when it kind of starts to get really fun, is when you start noticing the small picks and clicks that you make to make adjustments can absolutely completely turn around the momentum in a game. And so we were playing, we were playing a lot, we were playing with each other, and we were playing with people who were really good.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I mean, I spent the summer, I mean, Angie and Rebecca are like are some of our. Top players. And I spent the summer like harassing them, like, hey, can I play you? And I never walked on the court being like, you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna take them today. Like, I'm gonna just go 6-0 against them. Like, that was the never the expectation, but it challenged me to be like, okay, how can I get a point? How can I get a game? And then obviously, when you're doing this with friends, you end up laughing a lot, having fun. And it's not this weird competition, like as I get better, as they get better, as Abby gets better, like it's a win for the whole team. And so um it's it's almost hard too in those scenarios because you're playing against friends to like also take it seriously because you're like, that was an amazing shot. Like you're celebrating your opponent more than you would in a regular match. But um, it was a really good time frame to go from April until October for nationals. That's a long time to grow.

SPEAKER_04

And I would say too, I would add to that, yes, all the extra matches, all the extra lessons, the drills. But I feel like what I saw in our entire team is um just a growth in our mental strength, too. I think each of us had moments of kind of insecurities, like, oh my gosh, do we belong here? Or oh my gosh, am I good at this, am I good enough for this team? You know, it looked different for each of us, but something I was so proud of in just being friends with these girls and playing tennis is that I feel like we all had some version of a breakdown or a moment of insecurity, but we really we worked through that. And then we also, I know several girls on the team encouraged me too. And I just felt like as a leader, I felt like I couldn't have breakdowns. And then I finally did. And I just loved and am proud to say that these friends like came alongside and they're like encouraging and it's just beautiful the way that like Leanne was saying, we encourage each other and we compete. And then you just remind yourself if someone's better than you on the team, it's like great, this makes my team better. And so it was just it's really beautiful and it's really healthy. And I think that that is important for longevity for a team. It's to just emotionally as well.

SPEAKER_01

Well, I think in New York, when we went on that uh rose gold rally trip, one of the things y'all were talking about was who do you want to be on the court with that you feel great winning with, but you also feel great that losing with because there's that comfort. And I will say, like, that's our whole team. Like, we're gonna lock arms and we're gonna pull our best and we're gonna show grit, but there's no one on the team that I would play with as a partner and feel um like if we lost on the court, that it impacted our friendship in any way. And so there's a lot of safety within this team.

Nationals Day One: Validating The Research

SPEAKER_10

So so that's actually important not only for like just dealing with the losses, but that actually makes you play better too, because uh I interviewed um I think it was Murphy Jensen. It was one of the Jensen brothers. I think it was Murphy, and they won the French Open in I think 1992, and they had been struggling going into the French Open. They'd lost first round like several tournaments in a row, and Murphy uh it might be Luke, I might be getting the notes wrong, but I I think it was Murphy was worried about Luke going and finding another doubles partner, and then right before the French Open, Luke goes to Murphy and says, Hey, I'm not leaving you. Like, I am your partner, I'm your brother, I'm here. And they had been playing really bad, and that freed him up to play without pressure and without that fear of him or his doubles partner and brother looking for a new partner, and they ended up winning the French Open. So I I think knowing that you have that support, not only of your team, but also like your doubles partner um for the doubles lines, allows you to kind of play more free rather than when you double fault, you're like, oh, my partner's gonna start blaming me, and then that gets in your head, and that takes time away from your ability to do what Callie was talking about, which is you know, study the opponents, think about the strategy, think about their weaknesses and how to match up your strengths against them. So all this stuff kind of creates a recipe for a really strong team that y'all are talking about, um, along with the third point, it's just the rest. It sounds like y'all played a lot of tennis going into sectionals and nationals, and there's no substitute for that, especially if, again, like Callie said, you can play against better players. Because the best way to improve is to play against people better than you. Um, a lot of people that I talked to, whether it's 3-0, 3-5, 4-0, even A CP or WPA players, if you're playing weaker teams, it's hard to improve. So I I encourage people to ask themselves, you know, would that play have worked, would that shot have worked against a better team? And if not, you want to think about trying to improve upon that. So um I'll get off my soapbox for a second, but that was a lot of uh uh gears kind of grinding in my head there. Um so let's move on to nationals. Uh day one. So y'all won both matches. Y'all went 10 and 0, so each match was a sweep. Um I was following it on Instagram. I think y'all posted like the standings after day one. And I was like, oh, y'all went 10-0. And then I looked to the bottom of the standings, and both of the teams you had beaten were 0-10. So they lost to 5-0 to y'all, but then they lost 5-0 to the other teams too. So when I saw that, I was like, oh, well, they they can't be too confident yet because they played the two worst teams. So talk about day one and then what y'all kind of were feeling after going 10-0 on day one.

SPEAKER_01

Um well, it confirmed our research, actually. Um I went in knowing that uh both Hawaii and New York weren't gonna be as hard of a win as the Midwest and um what was the second? New England and New England on the second day. Um, and so one of the things that it just verified for me, like, is okay, when I lined everybody up, I always compared their very top players to our whole rep roster and like tried to match up, like, okay, Susie and Sally usually play line two 70% of the time. And then I would look to see who their other partners were. And so as I studied Hawaii and New York, um, their winning percentages weren't intimidating. Um, and their dynamic ratings were not overly intimidating. And so I just knew that we had a lot of flexibility within our roster on day one to play everyone. So day one, every single player on our team got to play. I think everyone was chomping at the bit. Um, we had a very favorable seed, um, which was a total blessing from the Lord and so grateful for that. Um, but it also gave me confidence going into day two. Like, this is what I expected, day one. I felt like we could win every line. It would be challenging, but I felt like we could. Day two, I knew Midwest was gonna be our hardest match of our seed. And um I even Abby and I even talked, and we're like, we need to tell Marianna up front that she's resting after the Midwest match. I didn't want to tell her that, hey, you're gonna be up against a really difficult singles player because I didn't want to get in her head. I just needed her to know she needed to rest before semifinals and finals because she was our singles player. And what's hilarious about that is on paper, the singles player was like Marianna's match. And I told a couple people, I was like, I'm resting Marianna after this because it's gonna feel like the Waco match that's like three hours long, insane, just based on everything I researched. I mean, you can't research time of and length of match, but I just anticipated it based on numbers. And no joke, they both walk on to the court and they're both fitness instructors. And I'm like, this is exactly how I imagined it in my head. And the rallies were like 30 ball rallies every time.

SPEAKER_00

And I I looked at Abby and I was like, I'm so glad that we already told her we were resting her because if she wins, she needs to rest. But even if she loses, she needs to rest. And I don't want her to think she's getting benched because she didn't pull a win, you know. Not that we doubted you, Marianna, but like we just knew it was going to be a long, brutal um match.

SPEAKER_01

And it and then the other thing about the Midwest that is a really cool thing. And so if your team is built this way, great. But they didn't have like these people always play line one, these people always play line two. Like it was a very equal team. Um, there wasn't a huge range in their dynamic rating. Um they didn't seem to have, which I think went against them in the long run. They didn't seem to have one set partner. The coach seemed to just mix match them all the time, um, which made it hard for me to research and know, but it also made it me realize like, hey, we're probably gonna not take all the lines. We're probably and it and it their line one may not look like line one on line one, it may look like line one on line two, just depending on who's with who. And so I went in thinking that we probably were gonna take three or four lines, but not all five. And that was the team that I felt like was tricky, and that one came down to a third set tiebreak to take the third match. Um it was pretty pretty close.

Day Two Battles And Mid-Match Switches

SPEAKER_10

Who who was in that match? The third set tiebreaker.

SPEAKER_07

Was that you, Marianna? Marianna. It was Marianna. It was Marianna.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. Okay, so it was it was yeah, I was like, Callie also did. Um we had one two lines, and then I was still playing, and Callie and Allie were still playing. Um, and we both ended up going into third set tie breaks.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_03

But I don't think either of us knew that it was, you know. I I don't know that I was paying attention to what it that it was gonna come down to one of us.

SPEAKER_10

Okay, so you were just like locked in, focused on your match, trying to win it, not worried about kind of the outside noise.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that was a um I mean that was kind of a tough match because it was at a different tennis center than um the Friday and Sunday were played at, and it was it was really small, and so um there was only there was like one deck, and the deck was next to my court. So all of the players and who weren't playing, and just everybody was right there, and so it was really loud and distracting, and I struggle with distractions, but um, so yeah, I tried you know as hard as I could to just um focus in because I think um Joshell helped me remember. I did I win, did I lose the first set and win the second set, or win the first set lose the second?

SPEAKER_10

Well, you split either way, everybody's shaking their head. No, they don't they don't remember.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, either way, I think everyone had pretty much been down in the first set. I feel like everyone lost the first set against the Midwest. That's what I mean. I do remember looking across the city.

SPEAKER_05

Jamie and I were partnered on Midwest morning. And Will, when you did the strategy session with our team before we went to Nationals, you stood behind each one of us as partners and kind of spoke into us after watching a few plays. And when you watched Jamie and I, who've been partnering together for over a year at this point in a certain formation, the only feedback is, why do y'all why do y'all play like this? We both were like, oh, what? Why do you say that? And I don't even know if you remember that well, but you were like, I'm confused why, you know, who's chosen Ad and Deuce based on the things that I'm watching here. And so Jamie and I, the morning of Midwest on day two of Nationals, we look down and we see that everyone, the other team, their numbers went up, meaning they everyone won like the first set. Um, it looked like maybe actually, Angie and Rebecca, you might have actually come back and won your first set. Maybe it didn't take y'all three. But we just remember looking down and going, oh my gosh, everyone needs us, like everyone's down. Um, and Jamie and I lost that first set, and she was like, maybe we should listen to Will. And we remember, Jamie? Do you want to talk about that?

SPEAKER_08

Yeah, I I've always played Deuce with Karen, and she's always played at. And um, Will, that's what you said to us is I I don't know, I feel like y'all could maybe switch. And I just think I was more comfortable in Deuce. I've been playing in Deuce, I played Deuce with Callie, but I was Karen and I we were like, they need us, and we just lost the first set, and then we knew we could win. That was part of it. A lot of these matches, like I just knew we could win. And so we switched and we took the second set, and then we took the third set tiebreaker. But it just really that helped. I feel like just um being confident that we could do that, even though it's not we were used to, because we hadn't played that way in our partnership. But we knew something had to switch after the first set. Um, and our opponents were not the same level. One was much better than the other one. So we had to figure that part out too, you know, like targeting that type of thing. But it just it worked for us to switch.

SPEAKER_10

Do you feel like switching? I love that y'all did that because so many teams are hesitant to do that. Um there are times when for sure you've got your clear sides, there's no reason to change it up. But I think with y'all uh there there must have been something I was saying, I don't remember this exactly, but maybe it was like a particular volley that was on the phone.

SPEAKER_05

Is that a left-handed volume?

SPEAKER_10

Okay, so you're lefty, you were playing add probably. And yeah, I typically prefer four hands in the middle, um, because that gets your four hand volley in the middle, which has more reach. So um I'm curious, do you think that switch uh threw the opponents off, and that's how it helped you, or do you think it got you all playing better, or maybe some combination of both?

SPEAKER_08

I I think it's a combination of both. I really think you helped us in that little bit of time in your strategy session, just um looking for the open spots and keeping the ball in play. But really, um I I know people play this way. I we were targeting the girl who was a weaker player. And I felt like if we could just keep it in and and target her, keep it away basically from the other one. We just the way Karen plays on Deuce because she's got this down the line that they don't expect because she's a lefty, and just her there worked. Um so I do think I I really feel like it was a combination.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, and when you're facing a weaker player like that, it is uh it's a hard thing to handle because you want to try to force the ball to them, but you don't want to overdo it, right? So it's um there's a balance of of you know targeting the weaker player, but not forcing it so much that you you end up making errors yourself. Um that's a a topic we could dive into on another podcast. But um yeah, that's that's really awesome that you are able to make that adjustment because so many teams do not make any adjustments after they lose a set, especially like 6'4 or something like that. And they think, oh, we just need to play better, but that's not really a plan. Um, you've got to change something, whether it's get to the net more, change return sides, start using serve formations, whatever it is. So that's that's awesome that you'll do that.

SPEAKER_08

I think because how much we've played since I'll just say April, all of us have gotten better at realizing okay, should we both stay back? Um, she's doing a cross-court return. I just think mentally all of our strategy has really grown because we've played so much, which means we've faced all these opponents, and we've just been able to kind of take the next step in doubles. And I I feel like Mariana, this probably you play singles a thousand times this year. It has it applies to singles too. The more reps you play, the smarter the player, I think.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah. Marianna, do you want to comment on that?

Singles Pattern Recognition And Adjustments

SPEAKER_03

Um, well, I mean, I think, yeah, it's absolutely because you just start seeing, you know, different things from different people and everybody plays their own style of singles. And so, you know, I I think when people ask me like, you know, to give them tips on how to play singles, the my biggest thing is like just spending those first two, three, four games just watching for patterns. Um, and you know, do they do they always return cross court or do they go down the line, or you know, do they come in after um a couple of you know rallies back and forth? And so, you know, just picking out um or you know, how they are they always serving wide, or do they change their serve up every time, or you know, is it this kind of serve on this side? So just picking up patterns and then trying to adjust to those patterns is um has kind of been my go-to strategy. And I had to use it several times in nationals, and um so anyway, I think that's it's applies to doubles too. You're looking for the weaker player, you're looking for any weaknesses they may have, and then just you know, watching for those. Are they lobbying every time, you know, or are they going down the line every time, you know, whatever it is.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah, yeah, I think that's the theme of this episode is like uh one of the things that frustrates me the most when I'm watching uh a tennis player, and this happens at every level, is when somebody plays, I call it just like a mindless tennis player. Somebody just keeps playing and they think they just need to play better. But what y'all are all saying is just through this year alone, you've improved your ability to make actual adjustments, not just get done with the first set, you lose, and you say, Oh, we just didn't play good, or they got lucky, or it was just that one point. It's like, no, this is their pattern, and this is how I'm gonna counter it. And I think that's that's a huge muscle to kind of work and train and continue to develop, and it sounds like that's what what y'all have been able to do. Um, I want to get to a couple more things and then we will hop off here. Uh talk about Sunday. So we've got the semifinals and the finals. Um, talk about your energy levels, talk about the matches, um, the lineups, uh, and then the finals as well.

SPEAKER_08

Ariana, you want to start?

SPEAKER_03

Um, sure. So um I mean, so that I got to rest Saturday afternoon and cheer for these amazing women playing New England, and that was it New England New England? Yeah. Um and those were all like crazy hard matches. So um I ended up playing a girl uh in the semifinals who I actually lost to. And um, you know, it's one of those things where I just said I look for patterns and with her, like I saw patterns, but I couldn't adjust enough. I couldn't adjust fast enough, and she was just better. So I think that's one thing I've really learned this year is that I think I used to play like what you were how you were just saying, Will like I would just get frustrated and either either just mentally give up or just think like they're just better than me. I can't do it. Um, I ended up getting six games on her. So like I made some good adjustments. She just she was just a better player.

SPEAKER_09

And um she was the the lacrosse player of her generation, is what we heard. She won four national championships in lacrosse, just stood athlete.

SPEAKER_03

She had really good hand-eye coordination, is what I keep saying. I'm like, you know, it's just better than mine, and that's okay. But I love that I didn't, I didn't, you know, I I got some games and I did make some good adjustments, and it was a great learning experience of just I think I I could have, I didn't go out hard enough. Um, and I I think I let her beat me in those first couple of games, and you know, and then had to try to come back, um, and then ended up losing and then did the same thing in the second set. So um anyway, I mean, but that was I felt good going into that, and I'm really thankful that they did rest me because that Saturday morning match was it was two and a half hours and it was a lot of tennis. And I I don't think I realized how tired I was. Um, so it was a it was a good, um, it was a good choice.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah. So so what about from uh somebody from the one of the doubles teams, maybe if y'all could share uh insights on your match. I'd also like to hear Marianna's talking about noticing the opponent's patterns. Um uh Karen and you and Jamie made that switch after the first set. If anybody else has examples from a doubles match of like an adjustment you made in the match, why you made that adjustment and then why you think it worked. Um, that I see two raising their hand. Angie and Rebecca, go ahead.

SPEAKER_07

We played um, and it was the New England match, actually. We played against our opponents. I've never played against anyone who hit the ball harder than both of them did. Just so many, they were winner after winner after winner, just like really, really impressive shots. And we got down in the first set five-one, and we just kind of looked at each other like, well, we're gonna lose, so let's just do let's adjust and let's see how many games we can get in. Let's see if we can get one game. And and it was so fast.

SPEAKER_09

I think I probably looking back, we would have we or should have made an adjustment sooner. It happened so fast, we were laughing out loud. It was, it felt like a joke.

Semifinals Pressure And Tactical Changes

SPEAKER_07

Like that is how there were no rallies, they just you send it over and they kill it, and it was just really incredible.

SPEAKER_06

Well, she was poaching from the opposite alley, Will. So, like she'd set up on the ad side and then go poach in the deuce side alley. Like it was unlike anything I've ever seen before.

SPEAKER_05

They were really good, but especially at 3-0 tennis. Yeah. Keep going Angie, Rebecca.

SPEAKER_07

What'd you do? Rebecca suggested we both go back and it really changed everything. Um, if we just suddenly were able, like if we were both back and back further behind the baseline than we're used to being in 3-0, we were like several feet behind the baseline, both of us, um, because they didn't have great shirt balls, they just could hit the ball really hard. Um, and we figured out how to get it back, and we ended up winning in two sets. It was really exciting.

SPEAKER_10

Wow. So y'all were down five-one and came back and won the first set.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they came back, won it seven, five, and then that's awesome. Six games in a row. That's awesome. Amazing.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, so so it really was so incredible. So Leanne and I were playing on the court next to them, and at some point, Leanne was like, Look, they're five five. And I was like, No way. Because I'm not kidding. Like, they really took your advice not to guard the alley. She was in the middle of the court the whole time, and she would run from alley to alley and poach hard and fast. And it was just incredible that they came back.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, I guess so. Against teams that hit the ball really hard, y'all chose to back up behind the baseline. That buys yourself time to react to that ball. So, like it's it's coming really fast off the racket, but then it hits the ground and then it loses speed, and then it gets past the bail baseline and it's moving slower, and now you have more time to kind of react to that. Um, the other option there, I guess, and it sounds like this maybe wasn't an option because those players also were very active at the net, would be to try to force somebody who it's with tons of power to redirect balls down the line, and hopefully you yield some errors from that. But if they also are very active at the net, sometimes that's not the best play, and it sounds like y'all chose the right one. So that's that's really awesome that you were able to find that. Um what about the finals or any other doubles adjustments that that were made? Because I love those, and I think the listeners like those a lot too.

SPEAKER_05

I wish they were here, but there was a couple of partners, um, Hillary and Allie. They had in their semifinal match, they I I had finished my match before theirs was finished, and it was the court next to me. So I was sitting there watching, and it was so great. One of the adjustments that I heard audibly, not you know, not to the opponent, but I was close enough on our side to hear Hillary say, that was three. I'm guarding the alley. So she kind of did the same thing. She kind of counted and like was hoping that they would try and miss. And then when they burned her, finally that third time, she was like, that was three changing. And I saw that game shift. And um, so it's just it that was a sweet adjustment that I saw them making as well. They kind of communicated about it, and I just happened to hear it tell her partner that was three. I'm guarding the alley. Um so I wish they could be here to tell you that story, but I just remember that moment.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah, yeah. I think that was one of the rules we went over in the training, right?

SPEAKER_05

Like if they it is, and actually, one of our girls who's also not here, I wish she was. Her name is Carrie. Carrie, whenever she goes down the line, we always we kind of had a joke whenever someone did, we're like, that's a corner, you know, like it's gonna go down from there. And Carrie's very good at that shot. And so she would hit it and it would be so good, and she'd go, We'll boot. It was so great. When she would like get it down and burn him down the alley. I wish she was here to tell that story too. But she would literally be like, Got it. Um, because she knew that it was a shot that, as you said, you it draws a bigger error because the court's shorter, you know.

SPEAKER_10

Right, right. Um, so I want to go to the finals. Uh tell me who did y'all play? What was the score? What did it come down to?

SPEAKER_07

It came down to Callie and Jamie. We appointed them. Yeah, I was pointing to you. Um, it was a really, really tough match against the Pacific Northwest, and they were a really, really tough team. And we had two wins and two losses. Actually, we had our first two losses first, and so there was a point at which we needed all three of the other courts to win. And at that point, I think Marianna was Oh, I didn't know that. I want Marianna to Marianna climbed back and was the first of those last three courts to win, and it was glorious. Her opponent was so hard, she was so good.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, will you talk about that? Because Marianna, I remember you coming off the court and you're like, there was this point where I had nothing to lose, so I changed my look.

Finals Comeback And Championship Tiebreak

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I mean, it was just kind of um like Rebecca and Angie. Well, I told Rebecca and Angie, I think had I not watched them come back from a one-five, um, I don't think that I would have had the mental fortitude to like try. But I was also down one five in the first set, and um I was just like kind of mad, like at myself and you know, for letting myself get there. But I this is another one that I just couldn't figure this girl out. Like she she went cross court, she went down the line, her serve was insane, and I just it's like I couldn't, I couldn't even get in a rally with her, and rallying is where I'm strong. Um, but at one five, I literally just told myself, like, you have nothing to lose, like just give it everything you have, go as hard as you can, be super aggressive. And and then I won that game, and then I won the next six games and came back in one seven five. Um, but then I managed to get myself in the same predicament in the second set and was down one four and had to climb back up um six, four. But I do just think like watching Angie and Rebecca the day before, and you know, and just all of us, like knowing how hard everybody fought throughout the whole weekend for every game, for every point, like it just was so encouraging, you know, even though I was by myself to just like keep going. Um and I'm glad I didn't know that I was needed to win, but um but I wasn't gonna lose, and you know, and I just had to make some big adjustments with like her serve um was so hard that I could not swing in it. Like I just had to block it back, and um, I had to adjust some to some crazy cross court returns. And so anyway, just again finding those, finding those patterns and finding ways to to fight back against them. Awesome.

SPEAKER_04

And Every one of her shots was hard. Her down the line, her cross court, even her swing volley was like powerful and strong and accurate. So that was really fun to watch.

SPEAKER_01

We have this picture of Marianna. I Marianna is like Mighty Mouse. Like she is how tall are you? Like five'1? Yeah. She's five-one, like as petite as they come. And there's this picture of her. And I can't help but laugh against this opponent. Like it is a literal representation of David and Goliath. Like there's like over a foot difference between the two of them. Over a foot. And a probably a change in size like twofold. Um, and so but like this woman was pure muscle. Like it was just it was just an incredible representation of David and Goliath.

SPEAKER_10

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_03

So then Callie and Janie.

SPEAKER_10

Yeah, so I want to hear from Callie and Janie. Y'all were the last. So it was two all, I guess, and y'all are the last match on. I'm sure everybody was in the sidelines. Uh before we actually get to like the match, tell me what when you knew it was too all, what was going through your head, and what did you say to each other?

SPEAKER_06

Did you know? That's the funny part, Will.

SPEAKER_10

Is you didn't know?

SPEAKER_06

I well, I yeah, I I don't think you know when you're about to get engaged and like you should really know that something's about to happen, but your mental faculties just get clouded, and you're like, I didn't put that together. Like, I I think we both knew in the back of our heads, but it was such an interesting match because number one, we were told this team is super scrappy, they're not nice, they're um they'll you know make bad calls. We were told that by some of the other players. And I think I'm just a firm believer in life that oftentimes you you get what you give to other people. These ladies could not have been nicer. Like they were they were kind, they were honest in their calls, but our first match was almost like we were goofing around. Like we won it, was it 6-0 or 6-1, Jamie? It was 6-1 in the first set. And I I literally stopped at one point in my brain and was like, this doesn't feel like a nationals, like finals. I don't know what's happening. And then in the second set, they switched gears and just to me, it felt like lob city, like took me out of the game. I'm I was the net player, took me out of the net. Like, and I what I feel like we didn't do in the second set was match the lob game because we have a stigma in our brain of no one wants to be a moonballer, and like that's not cool. And so it felt like we were trying other ways to compensate that just weren't working. And so I would say when we went into the third set tie break, everybody was down there. But I joked that you can really read my friend Rebecca's face, and I didn't let myself look at him at all, except I looked at Rebecca one time and she was laughing. And I had stood by her in one of the other set tie breaks, and she was a mess. So I was like, oh, maybe we don't really need to win. So Jamie and I just went to the bathroom together and we're talking to each other the whole time of like, we just have to think like we it has to be on us. But we didn't really realize that it was on us. You look back and you're like, oh, they probably would have called it if we, you know, had won. But I don't, Jamie, where what were you thinking?

SPEAKER_08

Well, I kind of realized it, but you tell me not to tell you. Okay, good.

unknown

Okay.

SPEAKER_10

That's so good.

SPEAKER_08

You said, if you know if this is on us, please don't tell me. I said, okay, I won't. I said, I don't I know, but I won't tell you. I was about 85% sure because I had seen two losses, and then all of a sudden I hear roaring just crazy like we won everything, and that was Marianna winning. But I didn't know that was Marianna's match. I just knew our team is cheering like we just won everything, but you and I are here, we'll start playing. So that's when I kind of thought, I think this is on us. And I know at one point, just like Karen and I had said before, I we had said our team needs us. That was at some point, maybe the second set. I don't remember. But I just I do remember we did go to the take that bathroom break after the second set. Our USTA guy gave us more time. He was very kind. And we just said, we're in this, we let's you know, power through. But I will say I I do not like attention, and I was put in a spot, it was up to us, and I don't like being there, but I will say that I I know God was there with us, just keeping us focused on our core, and I rarely, if not ever, looked to the side. I don't remember anyone's face. What I remember thinking is the demeanor of the people when I could kind of in my periphery see was almost like still bodies, not this moving. Like when we were at sectionals, we Angie and Rebecca played last. We had already won. So we were kind of already happy, smiling, laughing. That's not what I kind of gathered on our side. Um I just so I do, I just feel like there was something going on with Callie and I's focus, and literally we were down one five, and I was getting nervous. But in the tie break. This is where like I think all of our yeah, our competitiveness and our grit, like we didn't give up, just like they didn't give up, and Mary didn't give up, you know, because tennis can can it can change. It's one point at a time, and so we played literally one point at a time. Um, and that was the most fun I've ever had, honestly.

Strategy Session Takeaways

SPEAKER_10

Um, what what was the score in the tiebreaker?

unknown

12.

SPEAKER_08

So you were down one five, you won 12-10. They had a teammate point too. They were they were at two five.

SPEAKER_10

Okay. Okay. Um, so I want to hear from somebody who was on the sidelines. What were y'all talking about? What were you feeling? What were you thinking?

SPEAKER_05

I just looked over and Rebecca and Leanne. I love that Callie saw the one moment that Rebecca was laughing. Well, it was one moment like hysteria. Like because I look over and Rebecca and Leanne are holding hands like intently together, and then they let go for a second, and y'all lost one. You're like, we gotta hold hands the rest of the which was so funny. Um, and then the rest of us were like pacing. Um, one of the one of the cool parts about this weekend is that I feel like I really like the way you said it, Callie. You get what you give. Um, we were told by everyone, like, oh, this team, this team, this team. We were told that about the morning team as well. And it was all wrong because we had very friendly opponents, but our opponents, um, I had been visiting back and forth, and then I saw things. So I, you know, we're all like doing a little bit superstitious things, you know, like, oh, I was talking to her when they had that point. So I need to go back and talk to her, you know, whatever. Um, but that's kind of, I mean, everyone was just like this nervous energy and buzz. And I remember Jamie asked me, and I mean, it's such a I it was just the truth. Jamie said, Did you did you think we were gonna win? And I have to go back because my answer to her was no. And that's honest, it came out of my mouth, like, I didn't think you could do it. Um, but it wasn't that I didn't think that they could do it in that moment. Um, but I had in my brain, like I was preparing my heart, like, how does it feel if they don't do it? So that's what I meant when I said I didn't think you would do it. Because I had already kind of in my mind tried to be okay if we didn't win. And we were all, I think, ready to be okay with that because we were all really proud of, like we said, this has been a Cinderella story, you know, from the beginning. But even going into the finals when we originally had the lineup, um, I'd love, I mean, Callie had the day before had an injury. And again, the way that this team has put in the work to make sure that you don't just have one partner, but you've got strong partnerships that we can trust. Um, Jamie and I were actually supposed to play that finals match together, and Callie was supposed to play with a different partner that she hadn't repped with as much as she'd repped with Jamie. And I had repped with that other partner, Katie, who I wish could be on this call right now as well. We've now talked about the four people that could not be here with us, but uh Katie and I play on our TCD team, we're the captains of that team. So I doubled with her all the time. But Callie had had an injury on Thursday and really needed to rest her back in the semifinals match and was ready to go in for the finals. But I knew she needed Jamie. And so Leanne and Abby were amazing and allowed us to go and have that conversation to say, of course I want to play with Jamie. She's like my number one partner. But Jamie and Callie are also number one partners and they need each other because I want Callie to know that she has got a partner that she can trust without fail if her back hurts one second in that final match. Um they pulled it out.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, and Karen, I was just really proud that you came and you were like, this is wrong. We need to change it. And you were right. And then just it was really fun to watch on the sidelines because Jamie would tell you that one of her strengths is her lob. Like we all hate her lobs, they just magically fall right on the line. And then Callie really loves the net. But I was so impressed because in that tie break, it was like they both took on the exact role that they needed, even though it wasn't their preference. So Jamie would do 10 lobs and then one would fall short and Callie would slam it. But then Callie was on the baseline doing 10, her 10 lobs, and then Jamie would slam it down the middle. So it was just really beautiful to watch how they flowed and adjusted, even in something that maybe it wasn't their favorite thing. So that was fun to see.

SPEAKER_01

Well, and I think Abby, you bring up a really good point. The dynamic of our team, like, let's just say we were one of the only teams that didn't bring a coach. Um, we were also uh one of the only teams that didn't, I didn't know this was a thing, but you can pay a strategist to come in and like tell you what to do. All these teams were telling us they had done that. And I was like, wait, what? Um, so the benefit of that is like we weren't tied to this like protocol that we couldn't pivot from. Like it wasn't like we had paid someone Buco Bucks, and if we pivot and it doesn't work, like, oh my goodness, or like we weren't going to a coach and being like, we need to change this. Like, we weren't, it wasn't us versus a coach. It was like powwowing in the moment as equal to the new to me.

The Path To 3.5 And Beyond

SPEAKER_10

So this is new to me. So that there, these other teams had a coach and strategist that they paid to be there with them, and they were just telling you.

SPEAKER_01

No, they had a coach there, but they paid someone to research the other teams to come up with.

SPEAKER_10

Like what you did.

SPEAKER_01

What I did as well.

SPEAKER_10

Well, I was gonna tell you after the call you should start a service for it, but yeah, so it's like well, apparently you're better at it, so you could charge more.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, everybody give me a call.

SPEAKER_01

No, I just also teams in the finals being like, so who did you pay? to blah blah blah.

SPEAKER_10

And I was like, What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_01

We're so new to tennis, we didn't know that was a thing.

SPEAKER_10

That's so funny. All right, so another question uh about our training. We spent about two hours on court together. We did a little strategy presentation for 30 minutes where y'all asked me some questions and we watched a little bit of video. What were some of the biggest takeaways from that that you felt like helped you going into nationals?

SPEAKER_09

So I will say strategy often stresses me out when I hear that word, and when I think about a coach coming and trying to tell me how to change things up, um, that was stressful to me. What I really appreciated about your strategy session is that it it just felt totally doable. It was simple, straightforward. Um I just there were just little takeaways that I think made it definitely made a difference, but did not feel overwhelming. Um like for example, even just where I stand to receive on the ad side, to receive the serve. You just you were like, why are you standing that far over? And I was like, Well, I don't know. I've never and so now I think about it every single time I receive a serve on that side and I move over, and it's really helped. Um, and then and then the down the line thing too. Um I my body just naturally, I don't for whatever reason, I think probably because I I liked I used to really like, I mean, I still do, but not as much going down the line. Um, so I just naturally covered my line, um, guarded the line. And I think it was too much and it kept me from coaching when I should have. Um and so I mean, just that little thing that was another big takeaway. And then I think the other thing that was really encouraging was just um I think so. I think one really positive thing about our partnership is just our consistency. Um but I have felt often like I don't I'm not aggressive enough, and even been told like if you don't poach enough, you're not aggressive enough. Um it has kind of felt too I don't know, boring and basic and consistent. Um but it's but we win like that. So I think I felt encouraged hearing your talk because I thought it just made me realize, oh, I we have a good thing going. And it's not I don't have to be, it doesn't have to be like over the top aggressive. I don't have to poach every ball um to be good.

SPEAKER_10

So yeah, yeah. I mean, there's always just little small adjustments we can make that aren't like you said, like they're not that complicated, like moving your position on the return of serve, like it's very simple. You just take a step over and then you return the serve, you know. So I think that you know, when a lot of people do hear strategy, and uh a lot of this is a coaching thing. I I think our tennis culture has this like uh I don't know, complex relationship with coaching where a lot of coaches make things complicated or try to, I guess, put their um philosophies onto the player rather than like adapting to what they see from the player. Um so I think all that stuff is really important. Those are those are some awesome takeaways, and especially to have that freedom to be able to poach some, but you know, if you're more comfortable being that consistent player, that's okay, and your partner can back you up. So that that's really awesome. Um anybody else on training takeaways before we get to the next level, which is three five?

SPEAKER_07

I think a lot of them have come up just kind of organically in the discussion. Some of the things the more people telling you they were, you know, it's a lot of the things that you said really stuck with that some really helpful ways.

SPEAKER_10

So y'all just won 3-0 nationals, 3-5 is the next level. Uh what do you need to do to get back to nationals at the 3-5 level?

SPEAKER_07

I love it. I think the first is deciding that that's like an achievable goal, you know. That's not this pipe dream. I mean, not this year, but you know, I think that um as we keep playing together and keep um just improving and taking these steps forward, I very much see that as being an achievable goal. Um, I love playing with these women. We're we've already got, um, like Kelly said, the majority of us are already playing on a 3-5 team, but we're everyone's gonna be on that team next year. Um, we're gonna get more reps against harder opponents and practice taking the steps forward that we need to do to win more and more of those matches until we're ready to win them all.

SPEAKER_01

I was laughing with Jamie. We were in a three-five match, and it's stretching me right now, you know. But like a year and a half ago, I played my first 3-0 match, and I got creamed online three, 0606. Like I served myself up two bagels for my first match ever, and that was a year and a half ago. And then to think a year and a half from there until we win nationals, like what an achievement to go from like losing like that to being on a nationals team. And so now when I lose a 3-5 match, I'm like, it wasn't a double bagel. Like, I am not that far away from nationals, like it's totally achievable. Um, and so just thinking of it like that of like how much we've grown in a year and a half, and then being like, okay, I can I think I can grow that much again. You know, it's actually a really exciting goal.

SPEAKER_10

Leanne, I think you just gave us the title of this podcast, uh, From 0606 to National Champion.

SPEAKER_05

There you go. That's how we do.

SPEAKER_10

Um, y'all, this was a ton of fun. Uh, I think a lot of people are gonna get a ton out of this. Um, we talked about team chemistry, not only for doubles teams, but also your entire team. Uh, we talked a little bit about singles, we talked about noticing opponents' patterns and making adjustments. We talk about playing with the same partner, playing with the same skill level. Uh I could go on and on. Um, I think there's so many good takeaways from this. So, thank you all for coming on. Um, I loved the two hours we spent training. I hope it helped you. I think you'll probably would have won, anyways. Um, but congratulations and thanks again.

SPEAKER_08

Thank you, well. Thank you, well.